Getting 1:1 ratio with 120mm Makro

[pixelatedscraps]

Hi, I don't know too much about the two options for getting a 1:1 ratio with the 120mm Makro-Planar other than:

1) Bellows setup

2) Extension tubes

I'm open to both options but am quite confused and would appreciate a bit more information / advice about them. If I went the extension tube way, I know i need tubes totalling 121mm and will thereby lose two stops in doing so.

But what about the bellows option? I see a range of Hasselblad bellows options on eBay; square, round, auto (not needed), Pro-Shade, with railings, with/without double cable release. Is Pro-Shade a third party manufacturer? Because I see them going for about $200 when some of the Hasselblad ones are upwards of $500. What would I need in terms of your straight-forward bellows option to get 1:1 ratio on a 500CM and my 120mm Makro?

Thanks!

 

[polypal]

I would recommend the older manual bellows that comes with a double cable release unless you are into lots of images that bellows is a good option.

The auto bellows allows to use the camera like with any other lens.
You do not need to cock the lens manually.
Camera release can be done by a single cable release.

Manual bellows can be found around 200-300 USD.
It would be ideal if you could find the shade for that bellows as well.

The auto bellows is more expensive 400-700 USD and has a disadvantage.
The rails may disturb the subject because it moves forward.

If you need pictures what the se items llok like just mention it.
I have both bellows with their pro shades here.

Please note the minimum distance for the bellows is 64 mm.
A series of extension rings will allow for extension in the range under 64 mm.

 

[cs_foto]

Is Pro-Shade a third party manufacturer? Because I see them going for about $200 when some of the Hasselblad ones are upwards of $500. !

no mate, the Pro Shade is a bellows system used as lens hood, therefore it goes at the front of the lens, not between lens and body.

it is amazing by the way... although i am sometimes reluctant to carry it around because of the extra space it takes on the bag..

 

[polypal]

Pro Shades offer more effective shade than fixed hoods.

They are more vulnarable but should be first choice.

Do not forget with longer lenses you need to fit a mask, otherwise the PS does not work.

 

[pixelatedscraps]

I would recommend the older manual bellows that comes with a douible cable release unless you are into lots of images that bellows is a good option.

Manual bellows can be found around 200-300 USD.
It would be ideal if you could find the shade for that bellows as well.

If you need pictures what the se items llok like just mention it.
I have both bellows with their pro shades here.

Please note the minimum distance for the bellows is 64 mm.
A series of extension rings will allow for extension in the range under 64 mm.

That sounds great polypal - any pics of the kind of setup to be looking for would be great. The contraptions I've seen on eBay seem to have a railing system, a square or round bellows unit and a shade as well. Is that all I'm looking for, along with the cable release?

Thanks guys!

 

[cs_foto]

polypal

Pro Shades offer more effective shade than fixed hoods.

They are more vulnarable but should be first choice.

Do not forget with longer lenses you need to fit a mask, otherwise the PS does not work.

Since I got the ProShade I've always been worried that light leaks through the gaps of the adapter ring, is that right? how do people prevent light from leaking through...

Please see attached images, when I have the lens on it is pretty clear to me that light can pass through those gaps..

Cheers

 

[polypal]

The slots are meant for a filter holder that holder is often missing.
If you think these openings are a problem use a piece of black tape to cover them.

 

[polypal]

Manual Bellows



Manual bellows complete with shade.
This is not the way the bellows is operated.
I store the bellows with shade and lens this way.




Ready to fit a body to the bellows.

A double cable release is used to release the camera and the shutter.
It can be adjusted to release the body first, followed by the lens.

 

[pixelatedscraps]

You wouldn't happen to have one of these for sale would you, polypal?

As much as I love my 500CM, I am ruing the fact I completely overlooked the Rolleiflex SL66 with its built in bellows. Completely missed that when I was doing my research.

What would you say the main adv / disadv are to bellows vs. extension tubes. You lose stops with both methods, right?

 

[polypal]

The bellows in the picture with the 135 mm lens are part of my kit.
They are not for sale.

With extension rings you can cover the range from 8 mm till 64, that is the minimum extension for the bellows.
There are rings in the following sizes: 8/10/16/21/32/55/56 mm.
10/21/55 are extension rings from an older generation.

A bellows gives you continuously variable extension.
Theoretically you could cover the bellows range with a heap of rings.
That would not be practical.

Light loss is a function of the extension and occurs irrespective how the extension was arranged.

 

[Daniel Unkefer]

The bellows in the picture with the 135 mm lens are part of my kit.

Paul,
Is your black 135 Planar a T* lens, or Non-T*. Do you find that there is much difference, in your uses? Also, is the 135 sharp at infinity, properly stopped-down, of course. I already have a black T* 120mm F5.6 and I am really enjoying that one. The bellows and 135 Planar would add further versatility to my system.

My 40mm and 350mm Non-T* lenses are quite usuable for my uses.

 

[polypal]

Hello Daniel,

In principle WA lenses benefit the most from T*
Non T* lenses used with an effective shade will perform quite close to T* lenses can do.
It is not only flair but for some part also colour rendering that was improved by using T*.

T* is an improvement but do not think of this as dramatic.
It is in the 1-2% class under certain conditions.
Most of the time it will be hard to see any difference at all.

My 135 mm S-Planar lens has T*.
Please note the 135 mm S-Planar and the 135 mm Makro-Planar are not the same designs.
The S-Planar is a pure Macro lens that should not be used at larger distances not to speak of infinity.
Stopping down 2-3 stops helps a bit but keep in mind this lens was not built to be used at infinity.

The later CF versions, both the 120 and the 135, called Makro-Planar were less optimised for close range
and perform notacibly better at infinity.


Paul

 

[Daniel Unkefer]

Paul,
Thanks for the info.
I would want the 135 Planar-S, to complete my kit.
The Manual Bellows looks like something very useful to have, to use with my full selection of extension tubes. T* or Non-T*, I suppose it will come down to the price of the lens. I'm sure either version will be quite adaquate for my uses. The majority of my lenses are the T* variety, so that's my preference.

 

[polypal]

Just found for sale locally:






It does not say T* but this is quite a rare find.
If you want to know more send me a pm.

Paul

 

[Daniel Unkefer]

I Just bought one.

Found an decent deal, reduced to $150US in Excellent Condition. Just bought it. And the Shade and Slide Copy Attachment for $50US.

KEH has the black 135 Planar starting at $429US.

 

[Daniel Unkefer]

My Manual Bellows arrived today, it's quite nice to look through, with the 120mm F5.6 Planar. The rear mount appears to have a problem, although the apparatus is usuable, as-is. It should "click" and lock-on to a 500C/M, right? I tried it with both of my 500C/M's, and three of my Extension Tubes. -None- of them "click" and hold, so something needs replaced in the back mount, I think. David Odess might be able to fix this, I will ask. The Bellows works just fine and can be used as-is. Maybe Hasselblad USA has the parts needed, and I can do it myself. Or perhaps David or Essex Camera Repair, for me. Second-hand things can have subtle problems, that is for sure.

The Manual Bellows is impressive, I like it alot.

 

[polypal]

with some luck your S-Planar lens receives parts from the lens I bought as a spares carrier in the US.
I only needed the rear lensgroup, David Odess kept the rest of this lens.


Paul